Uh oh. Yesterday there were two comments... and I added a third. Now there's just the one. Who is erasing these comments? I thought this was supposed to be some sort of permanent record. ME
And furthermore... every damn time I want to post something I have to go through all this procedure: choose who I'm commenting as, verify my account, log in, give my password, get to the screen that tells me to make sense out of the scribble, get approval for pre-clearance to post... it's just too much BS. This is supposed to be so much more convenient than just sending emails, right?
"Uh oh. Yesterday there were two comments... and I added a third. Now there's just the one. Who is erasing these comments? I thought this was supposed to be some sort of permanent record. ME"
+ ++++++++++++++
I don't know. r u sure u have seen ur posts online here on this blog? MS
We all remember Aardvark Manor. In a way, we all still live there. We were so fresh, exploring, going our own ways out of the crazy mainstream. The Aardvark was our best refuge. No one could track and interfere with us there.
322 and 140 were almost the same, except we had the SBI, wiretaps, spies, PI's, Jessie Helms in Raleigh and other hasslers. We hurt no one physically, and rarely mentally.
Herb may been a sociopath or pscho not then, but only in the sense that he could not allow to realize or say that he may be wrong....?
The October mountain reunion was worth all of our efforts. My son Mark taped our conversations tha Friday eve and night at the Hall of the Mountain King (Chis' term). He was over here today and I listened to a lot of it, but by no means all.
He's gonna convert it to a CD so I can load and send it to you if you want. WOW John Reitzel has a good memory.
"Herb may been a sociopath or pscho not then, but only in the sense that he could not allow to realize or say that he may be wrong....?"
This thought seems unintelligibly put. Does it refer to the fact that Herb did not hold himself in check from inner conflicts, as so many people do?
Many among us have been brought up to be self-crippling... that is, they have second thoughts that prevent them from fully acting on any idea they may have. This unfortunate condition is brought on by the actions of parents, who do not want their children to be a bother. So they inflict upon them self-doubt,and the perpetual feeling that they may be "wrong".
Herb did not suffer from this. He was just straight-ahead, and did what he intended to do without reservation. So my question is this:
What is the leap from being a purposeful actor, as described above, and being either sociopathic or psychopathic? Could you spell this out for me? Is it anything like what parents used to say about children who had not been neuroticised by their parents, that they were "acting like wild Indians"?
A purposeful actor or activist was and maybe still is over against our backgrounds. Maybe some, raised, brainwashed and abused by parents and relatives (the infamous "uncle") cannot get over that. Some hide, some connived, some hated, some imitated, some did the same and took advantage when available.
I think we had to chip our way through to find our actual selves, on our own, purposeful actors overcoming any self-crippling, fears, reputations, insults, bent out of shape by societies' pliers, and finally finding and being ourseleves whatever the cost.
Those who do not get over and through the process may become, as you say, socio-psychopathic.
I did not see any inner conflicts in Herb. I respect him to this day, almost admire how he acted w/o care and put the mainstreamers on.
We all were holding things in check!
All I can say from experience is that, as you say, it was brought on by the actions of parents, who do not want their children to be a bother. So they inflict upon them self-doubt,and the perpetual feeling that they may be "wrong".
Yes, that's what my parents' did, but I did what I had or wanted to do nevertheless, tho' very conflicted. Whatever I was doing, wherever I was, I was uncertain with inner conflicts but got up the grit enough to do it anyway!
Still trying to understand the language. You say "Those who do not get over and through the process may become, as you say, socio-psychopathic." But those are not my words, they're yours. And I'm trying to figure out what you mean by them.
Sociopaths manipulate others for personal gain, and constitute society's predator class. Lots of them become politicians. Others, with less grandiose horizons, just become con artists.
Psychopaths inflict harm arising from delusional ideas. The guy who shot Gabby Giffords, for example, was a classic psychopath.
To me, neither concept has anything to do with us or our friends. If you have some other definition for either of those words, lay it on us.
"Sociopaths manipulate others for personal gain, and constitute society's predator class. Lots of them become politicians. Others, with less grandiose horizons, just become con artists.
Psychopaths inflict harm arising from delusional ideas. The guy who shot Gabby Giffords, for example, was a classic psychopath." ME
There has been, maybe still is, a little bit of a sociopath in me over my goal-seeking, activist days. The personal gain was for succeeding in goals and achievements for others but also to get me recognized and thus able to move deeper or onto something else I deemed important and necessary;
Sometimes, to achieve them - sometimes ones I only wanted to happen at first - I did manipulate, to get the necessary others' to support to accomplish. The processes were successful almost every time, but the backside of it was two-fold: the people found something new accomplished, even those that they said they wanted, but may have had later doubts that they may have done and been left with something they are unsure about or unknowing.
One of my worthless books is about that kind of manipulation, called, "Grand Rapids Michigan." I was not out to hurt anyone, but to oppose and out-maneuver opponents, regardless of how many.
It was not a chess game so much as a game of Go or checkers.
It would have broken anyone's spirit unless one was hard-core crimi. Prison is a traing class to produce psychopaths, kinda like the "bad" boys on Pleasure Island in "Pinnocchio."
I've been in jail only for overnights maybe 5 times. It's not fun, but did not change my character.
Prison is an all new matter.
Prisons for non-violencers is useless and a waste of out $$$ and time.
ME You're In!!
ReplyDeleteUh oh. Yesterday there were two comments... and I added a third. Now there's just the one. Who is erasing these comments? I thought this was supposed to be some sort of permanent record. ME
ReplyDeleteAnd furthermore... every damn time I want to post something I have to go through all this procedure: choose who I'm commenting as, verify my account, log in, give my password, get to the screen that tells me to make sense out of the scribble, get approval for pre-clearance to post... it's just too much BS. This is supposed to be so much more convenient than just sending emails, right?
ReplyDeleteIt is too much bs ms
ReplyDeleteI see two by you and two by me.
ReplyDelete"Uh oh. Yesterday there were two comments... and I added a third. Now there's just the one. Who is erasing these comments? I thought this was supposed to be some sort of permanent record. ME"
ReplyDelete+ ++++++++++++++
I don't know. r u sure u have seen ur posts online here on this blog? MS
We all remember Aardvark Manor. In a way, we all still live there. We were so fresh, exploring, going our own ways out of the crazy mainstream. The Aardvark was our best refuge. No one could track and interfere with us there.
ReplyDelete322 and 140 were almost the same, except we had the SBI, wiretaps, spies, PI's, Jessie Helms in Raleigh and other hasslers. We hurt no one physically, and rarely mentally.
Herb may been a sociopath or pscho not then, but only in the sense that he could not allow to realize or say that he may be wrong....?
The October mountain reunion was worth all of our efforts. My son Mark taped our conversations tha Friday eve and night at the Hall of the Mountain King (Chis' term). He was over here today and I listened to a lot of it, but by no means all.
ReplyDeleteHe's gonna convert it to a CD so I can load and send it to you if you want. WOW John Reitzel has a good memory.
Try the aardvark60 blog. You will have to sign in after your write a post, but it does not take long. That blog is effective.
ReplyDeleteThis one may be too, but with the same re-sign in after a post.
Not quite sure what this means:
ReplyDelete"Herb may been a sociopath or pscho not then, but only in the sense that he could not allow to realize or say that he may be wrong....?"
This thought seems unintelligibly put. Does it refer to the fact that Herb did not hold himself in check from inner conflicts, as so many people do?
Many among us have been brought up to be self-crippling... that is, they have second thoughts that prevent them from fully acting on any idea they may have. This unfortunate condition is brought on by the actions of parents, who do not want their children to be a bother. So they inflict upon them self-doubt,and the perpetual feeling that they may be "wrong".
Herb did not suffer from this. He was just straight-ahead, and did what he intended to do without reservation. So my question is this:
What is the leap from being a purposeful actor, as described above, and being either sociopathic or psychopathic? Could you spell this out for me? Is it anything like what parents used to say about children who had not been neuroticised by their parents, that they were "acting like wild Indians"?
I'm not sure I can make you understand, nor me!
ReplyDeleteA purposeful actor or activist was and maybe still is over against our backgrounds. Maybe some, raised, brainwashed and abused by parents and relatives (the infamous "uncle") cannot get over that. Some hide, some connived, some hated, some imitated, some did the same and took advantage when available.
I think we had to chip our way through to find our actual selves, on our own, purposeful actors overcoming any self-crippling, fears, reputations, insults, bent out of shape by societies' pliers, and finally finding and being ourseleves whatever the cost.
Those who do not get over and through the process may become, as you say, socio-psychopathic.
I did not see any inner conflicts in Herb. I respect him to this day, almost admire how he acted w/o care and put the mainstreamers on.
We all were holding things in check!
All I can say from experience is that, as you say, it was brought on by the actions of parents, who do not want their children to be a bother. So they inflict upon them self-doubt,and the perpetual feeling that they may be "wrong".
Yes, that's what my parents' did, but I did what I had or wanted to do nevertheless, tho' very conflicted. Whatever I was doing, wherever I was, I was uncertain with inner conflicts but got up the grit enough to do it anyway!
http://www.readbookonline.net/readOnLine/27022/
Still trying to understand the language. You say "Those who do not get over and through the process may become, as you say, socio-psychopathic." But those are not my words, they're yours. And I'm trying to figure out what you mean by them.
ReplyDeleteSociopaths manipulate others for personal gain, and constitute society's predator class. Lots of them become politicians. Others, with less grandiose horizons, just become con artists.
Psychopaths inflict harm arising from delusional ideas. The guy who shot Gabby Giffords, for example, was a classic psychopath.
To me, neither concept has anything to do with us or our friends. If you have some other definition for either of those words, lay it on us.
Neither concert has anything to do with us or our friends.
ReplyDeleteunless any of us think we may be....
ReplyDeleteDid you read the Whitman link?
ReplyDeleteDoes anybody have a photo, picture,or drawing of the Aardvark Manor.
ReplyDeleteWhere was it?
"Sociopaths manipulate others for personal gain, and constitute society's predator class. Lots of them become politicians. Others, with less grandiose horizons, just become con artists.
ReplyDeletePsychopaths inflict harm arising from delusional ideas. The guy who shot Gabby Giffords, for example, was a classic psychopath." ME
There has been, maybe still is, a little bit of a sociopath in me over my goal-seeking, activist days. The personal gain was for succeeding in goals and achievements for others but also to get me recognized and thus able to move deeper or onto something else I deemed important and necessary;
Sometimes, to achieve them - sometimes ones I only wanted to happen at first - I did manipulate, to get the necessary others' to support to accomplish. The processes were successful almost every time, but the backside of it was two-fold: the people found something new accomplished, even those that they said they wanted, but may have had later doubts that they may have done and been left with something they are unsure about or unknowing.
One of my worthless books is about that kind of manipulation, called, "Grand Rapids Michigan." I was not out to hurt anyone, but to oppose and out-maneuver opponents, regardless of how many.
It was not a chess game so much as a game of Go or checkers.
This blog seems to be our last stand. If e-mails back and forth are better, then let's do it.
ReplyDeleteSo far, this blog seems to be the only one that is stilll extant. Let's try it, at least.
It was prison that broke Herb's spirit.
ReplyDeleteIt would have broken anyone's spirit unless one was hard-core crimi. Prison is a traing class to produce psychopaths, kinda like the "bad" boys on Pleasure Island in "Pinnocchio."
I've been in jail only for overnights maybe 5 times. It's not fun, but did not change my character.
Prison is an all new matter.
Prisons for non-violencers is useless and a waste of out $$$ and time.
I simply want to talk with Mike, LL, Chris and maybe JReitzel (I don't think he cand do it).
ReplyDeleteMaybe we will just move on to the same way we left the Aardvark Manor. At least Tom Brame, LL and I lived there. Anyone else?
Aardvarks where are you?